00:00:00: Introduction
00:00:59: Present construction
00:01:51: Cause for the subject
00:03:40: Important statements
00:09:15: Shocking matters
00:12:13: Take-away actions
00:16:25: Remaining ideas
Helen Tupper: Hello, I am Helen.
Sarah Ellis: And I am Sarah.
Helen Tupper: And also you’re listening to the Squiggly Careers Videobook Membership! It is a new collection, Sarah, it is a new factor for the brand new yr. Are you excited?
Sarah Ellis: Yeah.
Helen Tupper: She is happy and that is going to be very helpful in your studying, everybody. That is week one of many Squiggly Careers Videobook Membership. Thanks for becoming a member of us. Hopefully, you are all signed up, so you have acquired your whole login to LIT Videobooks and you have got every thing that you want to study together with us this month. This week, our focus is on change, and the videobook that we’re going to be diving into and discussing is The way to Change by Katy Milkman. So in the present day, you have acquired a dialog the place Sarah and I are going to share our reflections from what we realized from the videobook after which tomorrow, in order that you realize what’s coming, Sarah has a dialog with Katy to get her perspective immediately. So, you have acquired a kind of two-part podcast, quick dialog in the present day between me and Sarah with our learnings, after which a dialogue with Sarah and Katy tomorrow.
Sarah Ellis: And so, the construction for our conversations collectively, we’ll begin with why we selected the subject, why we thought it was related within the context of Squiggly Careers; we’ll then share, from watching the movies, an announcement that caught out to us; then, one thing that shocked us, so perhaps simply one thing we did not know earlier than, or perhaps one thing that was counter to our present opinions; after which, an motion that we’re personally going to take having watched the videobook, as a result of I believe that is all the time what we’re making an attempt to do once we’re studying, is you do not simply wish to study in a vacuum, you all the time wish to be pondering, “Properly, how may this studying assist me; how can I be higher as a result of I’ve frolicked watching this videobook?” and that is the place it begins to really feel actually related for you, in your roles, in your profession.
So, we have tried to try this as effectively, and hopefully that’ll offer you a little bit of inspiration to get began too. So, change in a Squiggly Profession, in all probability the best one to attach the dots between Squiggly Careers and alter, as a result of we’ll all the time say that our careers in the present day are characterised by that change and uncertainty, the potential and prospects. And I used to be pondering, there’s change that occurs to us, so there may be typically various change that we expertise at work that’s out of our management, we would not know it is going to occur, so we do not count on it or we’re shocked by it; after which, there may be change that you just select. And I believe adjustments that you just select might be actually small or they are often actually vital, and it is the second sort of change that we’re actually specializing in in the present day and that the videobook actually focuses on. So, whether or not you wish to make a small change, like redesigning the way you perhaps get your work executed, or simply getting a bit higher at setting boundaries in every week, or whether or not you are like, “No, I’ve acquired a extremely large change in thoughts”, we’re speaking profession change, we’re speaking, “I’m going to train a lot extra this yr than I’ve ever executed earlier than”, or perhaps you have acquired, that is the yr you are doing a marathon. I noticed somebody we’re linked with, truly Daisy Buchanan, who’s been on the podcast earlier than, is doing the London Marathon.
So, you realize if you’re like, “Wow, she’s acquired a big — I do not assume she’s executed a marathon earlier than”, in order that’s a big change that you just’re like, “Properly, I’ve not executed one thing and I will do one thing”. I typically assume with change, it is a from and a to, I all the time consider froms and tos. And so, I believe we’re all making adjustments on a regular basis, we’re all selecting these adjustments that we wish to make and I believe it is all the time honest to say that a few of them are extra profitable than others, like some work and a few do not, and I believe watching this videobook helps you to determine what to do to present your self a greater probability of succeeding with any sort of change that you just select. So, Helen, what was the assertion that caught out for you?
Helen Tupper: And by the best way, Sarah and I’ve not shared our solutions.
Sarah Ellis: Oh, no.
Helen Tupper: So, there’s a hazard that it is the identical assertion, the identical shocking factor. And in addition, in case you hear me flicking, it is as a result of I made a lot of notes. I all the time assume that is an indication of a superb watch, is the place you have made a great deal of notes. So, the assertion that caught for me was, “Effectivity is laziness”. Did that work? That is not yours?
Sarah Ellis: No. I do do not forget that from the videobook and really, I did discuss to Katy a bit about that, so I believe it is a good one to select.
Helen Tupper: So, my takeaway from that assertion was, in order for you change to occur, truly we will sort of play into our sort of human laziness. So, you make it mainly actually, very easy to do one thing. She talks about designing defaults into your work. So, for instance, as an instance you assume, “Oh, are you aware what? I wish to begin my day with studying”, that is your factor, you are like, “I wish to begin my day with studying. That is one thing that I wish to do that yr. And so, I will put ten minutes of studying in my diary initially of each day”.
Now, I’d say that is solely 50% of how you’ll make that occur. So, it is good that you’ve got put that into your diary. That does make it a bit simpler in case you’ve designed it into your day, it has grow to be a little bit of a default. However you have not put the training into that second. You’ve got nonetheless acquired to search for the training, proper? And so, I believe truly, in case you put a coach-yourself query in, so you set in your week, you set your ten minutes in your diary initially of the day, and you then add the coach-yourself query in, so you’d actually open up that assembly, the query can be already there, then that is lazy studying, proper? You’ve got already executed the arduous be just right for you. And so, I believe these sort of nudges and moments the place this factor that you just wish to do is designed into your day and it has grow to be a default, I haven’t got to place a variety of effort into making it occur.
Sarah Ellis: Yeah, so mine was barely completely different. So, there is a phrase that Katy says the place she mentions, “Our thoughts is extra like a sieve than a sponge”. And I believe it is also slightly bit shocking as a result of I used to be like, “Oh, we all the time like to think about our minds as being spongy, once we’re studying and we’re absorbing lots”, however it’s value remembering how a lot we overlook, basically. And she or he talks about this concept of the ‘intention-action hole’, and straightaway I believe everybody goes, earlier than we even describe that, you get what that’s on the subject of change.
All of us have the perfect intentions, and there’s a motive that we then do not fairly observe that via to motion, although we wish to, it isn’t that we’re not dedicated to creating that change occur. And that is the place she talks about methods that simply assist us to shut that hole, in order that your intention is more likely to lead to motion. And so, whether or not that is issues like dedication gadgets, and a few of these are extra, I believe it is honest to say, extra carrots and a few of these are extra stick. And the stick ones are likely to work higher as a result of we’re extra motivated by issues like loss aversion. So, a dedication machine might be, for instance, like a monetary penalty. A number of the examples that she offers are like, “Okay, effectively if I do not do that, I’ve to present £10 or $50, I believe the instance is, to a charity that I do not help”, which I discovered a bit — I used to be like, “However absolutely all charities are superb?” however she was speaking about them from a political perspective. I believe within the US, there’d be some charities which are extra politically motivated.
Helen Tupper: Yeah, there is a man on the video who put £7,000, what was that web site? I used to be like, “I will lookup this web site”. Beeminder, and you may pay in your objectives. So, I believe he had this factor, he was going to skydive, and if he did not do it by a sure day, he’d mainly lose $7,000.
Sarah Ellis: I do know, that is actually dramatic, is not it?
Helen Tupper: Wow, it’s essential to actually care about skydiving!
Sarah Ellis: Yeah. And I do fairly like, I imply, a few of the videobooks, a few of the photos or the movies do shock you. So, there may be knife-throwing in that video.
Helen Tupper: Sure!
Sarah Ellis: So, if you have not watched it but and you are like, “I wasn’t actually anticipating to see knife throwing, however…”
Helen Tupper: The man with no shirt on throwing a knife!
Sarah Ellis: I do know, actually good!
Helen Tupper: I used to be like, “Okay, good for you!”
Sarah Ellis: In each videobook I’ve watched up to now, there’s something barely left discipline and random that I have been like, “Certain!” The opposite factor that may shut your intention-action hole is the folks you encompass your self with. So, if I’ve acquired one thing I wish to change, if I can discover another person who desires to make the identical change, and in case you can have that accountability group or connection, that makes a extremely large distinction. And reminders, however reminders that lower via, so uncommon reminders that seize your consideration, so they don’t seem to be too straightforward to disregard. And there is a lot of examples of these issues. It undoubtedly did make me assume, “Okay, I am fairly good at making intentions. I prefer to look forward and I am all the time fairly motivated by change”, however there may be undoubtedly generally a niche by way of these intentions and whether or not they come to fruition. And there are issues which you can begin to see that you just’re like, effectively, if I put this stuff in place, it does not imply I will do all of them, however I believe your share hit price of what number of adjustments you truly make would undoubtedly go up.
Helen Tupper: It sparks some concepts. You realize when she talked concerning the sort of shocking reminders, she had this instance of there was an alien on the video in entrance of a until.
Sarah Ellis: I discuss to her about that within the interview! She’s acquired the alien, like on the video she holds up the alien, she’s stored it!
Helen Tupper: So, the concept of the alien is it reminds you to do one thing. And it is nearly, as a result of it is shocking if you see it, it nearly acts as a little bit of a cue. And I used to be fascinated by our subsequent e book, which I will not go into an excessive amount of now, however there are particular actions that we might need folks to take because of studying our e book. And I used to be like, “Oh, how may we create the equal of the alien to assist folks bear in mind to take motion?” However some insights for an additional day, however it undoubtedly sparked my pondering there. So, second factor, what was one thing that she talked about that shocked you?
Sarah Ellis: So, she describes this concept of the ‘recent begin impact’, and I believe in my thoughts, that is a kind of issues that is nearly grow to be a bit commercialised, you realize like New 12 months, New You, and I used to be a bit sceptical about it and I used to be like, “I guess it does not work”. Like, January isn’t any completely different to every other month, nearly it is best to simply if you wish to make a change, it is best to simply make a change in that second. Nevertheless, what her analysis has proven is that truly, the recent begin impact is helpful, as a result of it kind of primes us to wish to change to do one thing completely different. And so, it does not should be January, it might probably truly be so simple as a Monday, like the beginning of every week; it might be publish your birthday; it may be publish a vacation.
Discovering these recent begin moments are literally good occasions to assume, “That is when I’ll begin to make a change”. So, I believe I might in all probability simply thought, “Oh, I simply guess that is not true”, as a result of you realize we all the time take into consideration damaged resolutions, you realize, how many individuals truly follow them? However one of many factors she does make, and I can not bear in mind the precise numbers, is sure, a lot of folks do not observe via on their resolutions, however are you aware what? Fairly an enormous share of individuals do. And so, you typically give attention to what does not occur, however then we kind of lose sight of what does occur. And so, in case you are fascinated by making a change and also you’re listening to this in January, that could be a good time. We’re in the correct of second. And if for no matter motive you are listening to this in one other second of the yr, you’ll be able to nearly deliberately set a recent begin impact by pondering, “I will begin on Monday”, or, “I will begin after this large occasion”, or, I do not know, “If I’ve acquired Friday off, then the following Monday could be a superb time to try this”. I believe simply not underestimating how helpful the recent begin impact might be, that was what shocked me.
Helen Tupper: So, mine was additionally the recent begin impact, however in order that I do not simply repeat what you mentioned, and I am simply going to flick via my notes, environmental adjustments can supercharge the recent begin impact. So, you have acquired Sarah’s factor of like the beginning of every week, or the beginning of a brand new job, or one thing like which are moments that create the recent begin. However in case you add that to an environmental change so, “I am now working in a special workplace”, or, “I am working in a special house”, these two issues collectively, it is a new week in a brand new place, that basically, actually supercharges how efficient that is for the recent begin and the re-committing to issues. We won’t all the time transfer workplaces, however we may work from a special place. I may assume, “Have you learnt what? On Monday, I will begin my day, I do not know, I will earn a living from home on a Monday and I will work in a café within the morning”, or one thing like that. My recent begin dedication, no matter it’s I wish to obtain that week, is extra prone to be efficient if perhaps I begin the week working in a barely completely different place. Perhaps it is the novelty of the brand new is compounded by these two issues. I believed, “That shocked me”. I hadn’t actually considered including these two issues collectively.
Sarah Ellis: So, what motion are you going to take? So, you have realized lots about change, and I believe we each actually loved this videobook. We had been each fairly fizzy, weren’t we, after it?
Helen Tupper: Yeah!
Sarah Ellis: We had been like, “Oh, that is actually useful”. It truly prompted a great deal of concepts for the work we do supporting folks with their Squiggly Careers, in addition to for the work do with organisations and for ourselves. I believe that is undoubtedly one the place we each felt like we realized lots and there was lots to use, a lot of attention-grabbing insights. So, from every thing, what was your motion?
Helen Tupper: I imply, I did just like the recent begin impact, so I did assume, “I’d simply take into consideration, throughout the yr, the place are my pure recent begin moments?” I believed I’d simply map these moments slightly bit. So, Monday seems like a superb one, how do I make {that a} recent begin? So, I like that. I additionally preferred, so you realize you talked concerning the reminders and shutting the intention-action hole, and he or she talked concerning the alien, like a cue could be a highly effective method to remind you of your intention? I believed I’d create a number of extra cues for issues that I wish to do. So, what I wrote down was, “When, then”. I will create a number of cues like, “When I’m on my Peloton, for instance, then I’d hearken to a podcast”. I all the time go on about like, “Oh, I have not acquired time to hearken to a podcast”. I sit on a Peloton for like two hours every week. I may in all probability Peloton while listening to a podcast. So, I believed I’d create a number of extra ‘when, then’ cues to assist me follow a few of the issues that I wish to do. So, that was simply an concept that was sparked by listening to her. What about you?
Sarah Ellis: So, mine was to be actually particular about adjustments you wish to make. And so, one of many issues that I wish to do extra in 2025 is simply how a lot I am utilizing AI as a part of the job that I do. And so, beforehand I might need mentioned, “I simply wish to use AI far more than I do in the present day”, and I might be like, “That is the change I wish to make”. And I believe from watching and studying from Katy, I used to be like, “That is not ok, that is not going to assist me to vary”. And so, one thing that may be a lot better can be, “I’m going to experiment with including AI into each constant assembly and second we’ve as an Wonderful If staff”, so then you’ll be able to actually pinpoint.
And there aren’t that lots of these, however I’d say, “in January”. So, nearly the extra you’ll be able to drill down into precisely what that change goes to be, what that is going to appear like, when are you going to do it, how are you going to make that occur, it is sort of like visualising, I suppose, however you have written down with a variety of readability what that change appears to be like like. I believe I may in all probability even go additional. That was my first try, and even speaking to you now, I am like, “Oh, after which I may…” like, I added January then once we had been simply speaking.
I hadn’t truly acquired that written down, as a result of I believed, “Truly, are you aware what? That in all probability feels real looking to do in a month”. After which truly, for February, I might in all probability wish to construct on that. Perhaps February is extra about making an attempt out some new instruments or some completely different instruments. And I believe by including that degree of what it appears to be like like, I really feel such as you’re then kind of pre-determining, “I will do it”. And she or he talks lots about, if you say a change out loud, if you share it with different folks, you kind of maintain your self to account a lot extra. Even in case you’re giving recommendation to different folks about AI, as a result of folks will ask us much more now about AI and careers, you are then more likely to take that recommendation for your self. For one thing like AI, which I believe is a a lot greater a part of what we’re doing now with our studying and growth round careers, I wish to practise what I am preaching, and to have the ability to give that recommendation in a extremely credible means. So, I like this concept of being actually granular about change. You realize the ‘5 whys approach’, the place you drill down, you drill down, you drill down? I believe it is kind of making use of that sort of logic to adjustments. So, in case you’re listening now and you have got a change you wish to make, I’d actually encourage you to convey it to life in as a lot element as you’ll be able to, as a result of I believe it is actually useful, and I believe you see the gaps you have acquired too.
Helen Tupper: It is fairly a pleasant hyperlink as effectively with subsequent week’s subject on affect, you realize that concept of you make a dedication, after which what folks are likely to do is that they act in methods which are in step with that dedication. So, having now mentioned out loud that that’s what you are going to do, you’re more likely to then act in ways in which reinforce what you have mentioned out loud to our hundreds of listeners and learners who’re a part of the Videobook Membership. So, that’s it for in the present day, as a result of we wish to preserve this quick so that you just go spend a while hopefully watching the videobook and taking your personal learnings from it. However Sarah will likely be again tomorrow for her dialog with Katy. So, some fast insights into what we will count on from that dialog, Sarah?
Sarah Ellis: I believe Katy does a superb job of summarising the insights she’s gained from her analysis, which is over a protracted time period. She’s acquired actually good examples. And one of many issues that we have not talked about in the present day, which we do discuss in our dialog, are issues like gamification and play, and the way essential having fun with change is, and this concept of one thing referred to as ‘temptation bundles’, which once more, neither of us have picked out in our dialog in the present day, however I did discover actually attention-grabbing. So, there is a little bit of reinforcing a few of the ideas you and I’ve talked about, however there’s additionally various new information as effectively.
Helen Tupper: So, hopefully you discovered this a helpful dialog and that you’ll be part of us for our neighborhood dialogue, which is on Thursday. It’s best to have the entire hyperlinks for that if you wish to come and contribute to that, but when you have not, simply electronic mail us, helenandsarah@squigglycareers.com. And thanks for becoming a member of us within the Squiggly Careers Videobook Membership. Sarah Ellis: Thanks a lot for listening everybody, see you once more quickly.
